Frontpage Interview’s guest today is Dave Gaubatz, the first U.S. civilian (1811) Federal Agent deployed to Iraq in 2003. He is currently the Director of the Mapping Sharia Project and the Owner of DG Counter-terrorism Publishing (dgaubatz.blogspot.com). He can be contacted at email@example.com.
FP: Dave Gaubatz, welcome to Frontpage Interview.
Gaubatz: Thank you.
FP: You have done an immense amount of research and work in counter-terrorism. As an expert, tell us one thing: What is the major threat that our country faces?
Gaubatz: Thank you Jamie. The answer is simple: Jihad. But it is not Jihad in the traditional sense of terrorist attacks such as on Sept. 11th, 2001. Contrary to what the American public is led to believe, Islamic Jihadists, specifically the leadership, are well trained, educated, and know how to recruit supporters to carry out Jihad. It is important to clarify the various forms of Jihad. Most Islamic scholars publicly define Jihad as a peaceful internal struggle (such as prayer). This is a weak and partial definition. Islamic scholars rely on the naïve non-Muslims to search no further. All practicing Muslims know there are other aspects of Jihad. Jihad includes physical (fighting), the use of the pen, and the use of the tongue to fight against their enemies.
In Iraq, Afghanistan, and in America, Islamic Jihadists are using a combination of the pen, tongue, and physical Jihad against innocent Muslims and non-Muslims worldwide. The gravest danger to America is the use of the ‘pen’ and ‘tongue’ by Jihadists and their supporters. Jihad is currently being waged in America as we idly stand by and pat ourselves on the back for not having another physical attack. In actuality we are under attack and the destruction is many times worse than Sept. 11th, 2001.
FP: Can you provide an example or two of the ‘pen’ and ‘tongue’ being a form of Jihad?
Gaubatz: There are very subtle and deceiving forms of the use of the pen and tongue. The Islamic Society of North America (ISNA), and the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), are prime examples of using the Jihadist method of the pen and tongue. Both utilize the television, internet, and develop source networks with important political and law enforcement officials. They understand in our current point of history America is very vulnerable. If another terrorist attack were to take place in America similar to 911, it would set these organizations back 20 years. They understand there is a time for terrorist attacks and then there is a time to use the pen and tongue form of attacks against their enemies.
FP: An example?
Gaubatz: Both organizations distribute brochures to our public school administrators “designed to assist teachers, principals and other educators in formulating and implementing policies and programs that will help create a culturally-sensitive academic environment” (CAIR: An Educators Guide to Islamic Religious Practices). A cursory reading of the brochures appear to be innocent enough, but if one reads the booklets word for word, attend CAIR and ISNA meetings, review the hundreds of other books and brochures they produce and/or give support to, the hidden messages are revealed. The message by CAIR and ISNA is to not pledge allegiance or loyalty to America.
I can give thousands of examples (every troop who gave his/her life in times of war for America) of what an American is and I believe most would agree an American should show allegiance to our country. Do CAIR, ISNA, or most Islamic scholars operating in the U.S. advocate pledging allegiance to America?
From the ISNA educators brochure: “On behalf of ISNA, the largest national organization of Muslims in the United States and Canada, and in view of the above teachings of Islam, I would like to request that Muslim students in your school system not be required to pay allegiance to the flag” (ISNA brochure “You’ve Got a Muslim Child in your School). This message is hidden in the fine print of the six page brochure.
CAIR has a similar statement to school administrators: “Pledge of Allegiance: Islam discourages acts of reverence to anyone or anything but God. Some Muslims may be hesitant to recite the pledge of allegiance. Many Muslim parents teach their children to stand up but not recite the pledge”.
If one does not pledge his loyalty and allegiance to America can one ever be an American? Our U.S. Constitution clearly states you must, but more importantly the moral fiber of anyone who cares and loves their country dictates you must pledge allegiance to it.
If one reads “The Manifesto of Islam”, by Sheik Muhammad Ashiraf, published in Pakistan, and located in many Islamic bookstores throughout the U.S. you will get a better idea of why CAIR and ISNA inform educators Muslims should not pledge allegiance to America. “It is not possible for an individual to be a good Christian or a good Muslim and a good Nationalist or Democrat at the same time. The political idea of an individual dominates his entire life. When a religion or philosophical creed is not the political ideal of an individual, it is really an idea which is sub-serving his political idea and not determining any of his activities itself..If a person who thinks that he can love two ideas at the same time, eg the ideals of Christianity and Nationalism, his misunderstanding will be removed the moment he is faced with a situation in which the demands of two ideals come into conflict with each other”.
The hidden message ISNA, CAIR, and a host of other Islamic organizations and scholars is that these supporters of Jihad against America do not want Muslims to pledge allegiance to our country. America is a non Islamic State, is not built around Islamic values, and is not (perhaps not) led by an Islamic and Sharia compliant scholar.
FP: So is it fair to say that most Muslims in America support Islamic Jihadists more than they do the U.S.?
Gaubatz: I am saying based on my visits to hundreds of Islamic Centers both here in the U.S., and several countries, my discussions with hundreds of Islamic leaders and worshippers, and my research of hundreds of hours of lectures by Islamic scholars currently in America, it is an accurate statement per the Muslims words themselves.
Recently we have seen thousands of Muslims across the U.S. protesting against Israel attacking Palestinians. Muslims in Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Iran, and other countries strongly pledge allegiance to their country. Muslims strongly pledge a loyalty to Prophet Mohammed to Mecca in Saudi Arabia, and to Jerusalem. For CAIR and ISNA to advocate the Muslim children not to pledge allegiance to America (while in America) is hypocrisy.
It is important to clarify all Muslims residing in America do not adhere to the ideology of their scholars, but to the Muslim scholars and groups such as ISNA and CAIR, the people are not ‘true’ Muslims. A Sunni Islamic leader in Richmond, Virginia informed me just because Shiite people say they are Muslim does not mean they are really Muslim. Just as a person who says he/she is Christian and does not follow (or believe in) the basic ‘Ten Commandments of the Bible. The “Manifesto of Islam” and a hundred other reference materials used by Islamic scholars clearly state you are either a Muslim and desire for an Islamic State, with an Islamic leader, or you are the enemy of Islam.
The Islamic Jihadists ideology is just as much a danger to Muslims who disagree with them as it is to non-Muslims.
FP: Can you give us a few more examples of the pen and tongue form of Jihad being used in America?
Gaubatz: During my years of research I have came across many Islamic Jihadist internet sites. They are being used in America to recruit (brainwash) young Muslim children and
adults to adhere to their violent ideology. I have talked with several Muslims who stumble across these sites. The internet is used as a tool of propaganda and to stir the emotions of Muslims to hate Israel and anyone or country that supports them. The Jihadist sites are also training tools on how to fight the enemies of Islam. I have reviewed sites that show Jihadists how to execute the enemy when captured. Nihad Awad (CAIR) and other Jihadist supporters will of course say this is being taken completely out of context. I respectfully ask Mr. Awad and Islamic scholars to write letters to these organizations based in Iraq to condemn their ideology. If CAIR and ISNA do not advocate violence against America and non Muslims I would ask they organize a rally to remove the thousands of books, tapes, DVDs, and manuals written by Islamic terrorists from the thousands of Islamic Centers across America.
On several occasions I have visited the Islamic Center of DC, 2551 Massachusetts Ave, Washington, DC. This center is located on Embassy Row and is used as a public relations tool for U.S. Presidents and other U.S. policy making officials. It is sad to say but the leaders of this center are laughing behind the backs of our leaders each time they visit. While at this center I have been provided materials written by Islamic terrorists, and the materials call for killing non Muslims and advocate turning America into an Islamic State. I strongly encourage our leaders to educate themselves on counter-terrorism issues and to know even who the terrorist supporters are in our country. Why would CAIR, ISNA, and the Islamic Center of DC use as examples of understanding Islam a book written by a convicted terrorist Ali AlTimimi (currently residing in a U.S. prison serving life plus 80 years). The answer is because AlTimimi and others with like minded ideologies are respected by the leaders of Islam in the U.S.
Is a book endorsed by a convicted terrorist the best Islamic organizations can provide to non Muslims to better understanding Islam? What if Christian organizations were to use a book written by Timothy McVeigh (OKC Bomber) as an example of how to understand Christianity? It would rightly be called ludicrous.
FP: What can we do to prevent organizations that allegedly support terrorism from continuing to damage America?
Gaubatz: We could begin by shutting down organizations immediately such as ISNA, CAIR, and any Islamic Center that openly supports either. Islamic scholars openly state there are certain times Jihad (physical fighting) is appropriate when the Muslim people are being oppressed. They will argue throughout history and currently the Muslim people could be called to Jihad to protect Islam or Muslims if the correct authority called for this action. In America there is only one authority for any American to fight in combat and that is by our President. There is no Islamic scholar who can tell any Muslim living in America to go to war. We could shut down most Islamic 501 non profit organizations (NPO) based on this alone. No NPO can have in their bylaws (written or unwritten) a call for members to be a part of any military combat unit aside from the U.S. Armed forces. People need only review the lectures and literature distributed by Imam Siraj Wahhaj, Brooklyn, NY, to clearly understand he advocates calling Muslims to war against their enemies when the time is right. Wahhaj considers himself an Amir (leader/ruler/prince) of the Muslim people. I can name 750 Islamic centers that support Wahhaj and his violent ideology. Close 750 Islamic Centers, ISNA, CAIR, and we will have shut down 95% of the ‘Jihad recruiting stations’.
FP: Dave Gaubatz, thank you for joining Frontpage Interview.
Gaubatz: My pleasure.